Of Swords and Soulmates

"Six Scorched Roses" - Is it a Kissing Novella?

• Mari • Season 1 • Episode 13

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Ever wondered how book bans impact the genres we love, particularly romance and romantasy? This week on "Of Swords and Soulmates," we begin with a light-hearted mix-up about Jonathan's podcast persona, JP. Then, we're thrilled to share the latest buzz from the romanticist book world, spotlighting Katie Roberts' stunning opus collection for her "Deal with the Demon" series and Jennifer Armantrout's special edition collaboration for her "Blood and Ash" series. We also dive into the recent book bans in Utah. Hear our take on how these bans affect beloved authors like Sarah J. Maas, Judy Blume, and Margaret Atwood, and the broader implications this has on genres predominantly enjoyed by women.

As we segue into our main topic, get ready for an intriguing discussion on Carissa Broadbent's "Six Scorched Roses," a romanticist story you won't want to miss.
we discuss this fascinating novella that combines elements of Beauty and the Beast with a unique vampire twist. We delve into themes of classism, neurodivergence, and the blend of magic and science within the story. Our hosts debate the novella's brevity and its impact on the depth of the fantasy elements, with a lively rating discussion to boot. Don't miss our next episode, where we'll review "Assistant to the Villain" by Hannah Nicole Mayer!

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Ashley:

Views expressed in this podcast are solely those of the participants. The hosts make no claim to be literary experts and their opinions are exactly that opinions. All creative works discussed or reviewed are the intellectual property of the creators of said stories and is being used under the Fair Use Doctrine.

Mari:

Hello and welcome to Of Swords and Soulmates, a podcast where we read, watch and discuss romanticist stories. I'm one of your hosts, mari, and with me I have Kelly.

Kelly:

Hey everyone, it's Kelly and we also have Ashley.

Ashley:

Hey guys, it's Ashley. We also have Jonathan.

Jonathan:

Is that what we always say, jonathan?

Ashley:

yeah, you call yourself jp, but I call, it's me jp, I'm here.

Jonathan:

I made it another week in the books you weren't sure about your name no, I don't understand.

Ashley:

When have I ever called you jp I?

Mari:

don't know, sorry. Do you want us to start calling you JP?

Jonathan:

No, you don't have to. I have no.

Ashley:

You do this just for the show.

Jonathan:

JP. Yeah, I sometimes do it in the email too. Sometimes I like to sign my emails. Ty JP Back on.

Ashley:

Get back on track. Jonathan is a long name.

Mari:

I understand I have a long name too, totally understood.

Jonathan:

But your podcast persona, I'm just saying oh good, yeah, you can have a show name.

Mari:

The voice, your stage name.

Mari:

Ooh, it's like a nom de plume yeah, getting fancy, I like it All right. So today we're going to be discussing Six Scorched Roses by Carissa Broadbent, but first, as always, some news. There was a good bit, um. One of the things that I saw is that katie roberts is doing kind of like the same thing that juliet cross did, that we've talked about in the past. So she's got an agreement with a fake rate and she's doing an opus collection. So do you guys remember when we talked about the stay a spell series, where it's like the whole thing and you order it and you get it like you, or you buy the set and you get it a few months after, right? So this is the same thing for Katie Roberts series. It's called the Deal with the Demon.

Kelly:

Yeah, katie Roberts, the Deal with the Devil, also called the Devil Faustian.

Mari:

Bargain. I'm so sorry.

Kelly:

Thanks, Siri.

Mari:

Yeah, Siri decided that we needed to know what that was.

Ashley:

The pause that we all just took trying to figure out who was to blame. I was like the demon has something to say. It wasn't me. My phone was down there.

Mari:

Wow, katie Roberts' Deal with the Demons series is basically one of her series that is, monster romances. So it's a demon who sets up this pact between humans and these creatures in his world. I don't know what the world is called. It's been a while since I read them, but you have like the first book is a deal with a dragon, I think, and the second one's like a deal with a kraken.

Mari:

Oh yes, you've heard of these of these, the cover that I've seen, yes, deal with a succubus, a deal with demon. I think the last one that's coming out in, maybe later this year, is the demon's queen or a deal with the demon's queen, something like that.

Ashley:

They're, they're short, there's a gargoyle.

Mari:

Yeah, gargle, that's the one I missed. Yeah, they're short, easy reads. They're on kindle unlimited, that's where I read them sold.

Mari:

I think there are six or there will be six. The sixth one is coming out this year. So of the ones that are out, I believe I've read four. I haven't read the fifth one.

Mari:

So the the what they've shown of the covers for this is are really pretty. The covers are by kira knight art. It's hardcover embossed artwork with foiling accents by lichen and limestone, which I know we've talked about their stuff before. It's digitally printed page edges, digitally signed tip-in pages, so it's's a digital signature. It's $160 for the set and that includes shipping and their pre-orders and they would be shipping in December 2024 to January 2025. They're really pretty.

Mari:

I mean, I probably won't be getting them because they're fun, but I don't know that I'd reread them and I try not to have book trophies for books that I'm not going to be rereading because limited book space on bookshelves. It's reasonable, yeah, yeah, but they're really pretty and they're fun reads. I would definitely recommend reading them, even if you're not going to get the fancy set. But, as we've talked before, katie Roberts is high spice, so whether or not that's your cup of tea, the whether or not that's your cup of tea. The other thing I saw was that Jennifer Armantrout is doing a special edition of her books. It's with Blue Box Press. It's like a collaboration and the Arcane Society is who's producing these. I've never bought anything by the Arcane Society, but it's her Blood and Ash series which I've only read the first one of. I haven't read the rest but you liked it.

Mari:

I liked it. Yeah, I definitely am planning on continuing it. These books are beautiful. They're so pretty Like I really want to read the rest so I can decide if I'm going to buy them. Because if I'm going to buy a hardcover like these would be really pretty ones. So they're they have just just edges and endpapers designed by C-E-I-L-L-O I'm sorry if there's a different way to say that artist's name. They have a reverse dust jacket. So you know that's always nice to have options. They have illustrations, they have a hard case cover and a tip-in design. They're going to be signed. So it's five books. The first one is got a signature by Jennifer Armentrout and then the rest are going to be digital signature. It's the whole set is $195 plus shipping. They haven't announced when it's going to go on sale, when it's going to be sent, all that stuff, but it's five books for 195. I mean, that's what? 20, 20 bucks a book, math, yeah, I believe so what 20?

Ashley:

Is that 20 bucks a book? Math? Yeah, I believe. So, just about. Yeah, I mean, I guess I hear such amazing things about JLA, like she's, I think, probably one of the first authors that caught my TikTok attention when, like just when book talk was becoming a thing, and she is like there's a cult following. Yeah, very similar, you know, to SJM, sarah J Maas, yeah, and I did hear that she was equally as spicy. She's supposed to be a fantastic writer and regretfully I don't even think I own one of her books which is on me but like she's supposed to be top tier. She's also part of a lot of book conventions, like the book cons I think she runs a Polycon, I believe, and like spearheads them is what I understand. So like kudos to her for getting it done.

Mari:

Yeah, the boss. Definitely on the list. On the list to read that ever-growing TBR.

Ashley:

Ever-growing and ever-shuffling tbr we're packing and so like I had like three 27 gallon totes pretty filled with books and so like I'm stacking them in the room that they're gonna go in and I have them all stacked up against the wall and I was looking at them this week, like all of my books in one place, and I was like this is not an absurd amount of books, but it's probably an absurd amount of money, like a disgusting amount of money if I thought about it. So I decided to stop thinking about it.

Mari:

But I mean, you get an experience from those books. Yes, so what you're paying for is the experience, like if you tallied up how much money you spent on whatever pizza in a year, or something you know.

Ashley:

But it's an experience. I didn't need that perspective. I don't want to be pizza shamed. It's almost Friday, that's so sad.

Mari:

I'm trying to not book, shame you. I wasn't trying to pizza, shame you.

Ashley:

No, it's pizza. Shame Gosh. Nothing from the peanut gallery over there. He was so mad when he had to carry my books.

Jonathan:

Made her split them up.

Mari:

They were so fucking heavy. It's a strength workout. It's good for you.

Jonathan:

It was not great, it was an enemy workout. She just looks at you, she's like what did I do? Put them not great it was, it was in the new work I was so much. She just looks at you, she's like but what I did? Put them all in the same box. I thought that's what you told me to do. You know what I thought about when I was like a collapsed star like if you put like a teaspoon of star, it's like 1500 billion tons or whatever. I was just like.

Mari:

This is like a collapsed star, get, get the little little trolley thing with wheels yeah, yeah, it almost we had to do.

Jonathan:

She almost broke it.

Ashley:

Oh, he had to rent an industrial one for this weekend, but the whole, but not for my books, the rest is for his thing all right on to the rest of the news.

Mari:

the title for the second moonfall book has been released. So the first one is the when the Moon Hatched by Sarah A Parker that series, oh yeah. The title of the second one is going to be called the Ballad of Falling Dragons. I'm intrigued. Yep. It releases October 2025 in the States and we'll include a link in the show notes and it's an Amazon affiliate link. But just to shoot link in the show notes and it's a amazon affiliate link, but just to shoot myself in the foot here. If you wanted to get it earlier and get a signed version, you can actually get it july 2025, a signed version for like the regular price if you get it from waterstones. But of course that's the uk, so you're paying, paying for shipping.

Mari:

I'm nauseous thinking about that cost it's it's not great, but it's also it's like a signed book and I don't know that I would ever get to go anywhere where well, I don't know that I would get to go anywhere where she's going to be signing and also that I would be willing to probably stand at a huge line or whatever it would take, because I am slightly allergic to lines, as you guys know.

Ashley:

So, kelly, prepare your wallet. That's what I'm hearing.

Kelly:

She has her own money. Oh, this is true.

Jonathan:

It's 2024, actually.

Mari:

So I'm excited about the title. I know I don't think I don't think any of you guys have read it yet.

Ashley:

Right, have read the first one no, this is the one where I didn't get past the glossary.

Mari:

The glossary, yeah the glossary is very intimidating for anyone who's wanting to read it. Just completely skip the glossary, just start with the book, yeah, yeah, and then, just if you need it, you can always refer back to it. I think I maybe referred back to it two or three times, so it's not like it's that bad. It really isn't. She's a dense one too, right? Yeah, it's like I don't know. 700 pages, 600 pages it's a chunky, chunky, chunky read.

Ashley:

Mari, you're a rock star. The way that you just devour these books, I mean, I have months like that, Kate, but it's not consistent.

Mari:

I just get way into them and I don't want to stop reading, which is not so great for my sleep schedule, as Kelly will attest to. Poor Kelly has learned to fall asleep by Kindle Lite.

Jonathan:

You don't have a sleep mask, Kelly. I got myself a sleep mask.

Ashley:

It doesn't bother me, that's not why you got it.

Mari:

Okay. So the last little bit of news is there is a book coming out and I've not read anything by this author, but I was intrigued by the cover. The book is called Lucy Undying, a Dracula novel by Kirsten White. It releases September 10th and it's basically like an alternate Dracula retelling. It's what if Lucy didn't die? What if she kind of lives on, finds herself, gets into a little sapphic romance and then kills Dracula for revenge? Good for Lucy, Right.

Jonathan:

Who's Lucy?

Mari:

Did you watch the Dracula movie?

Jonathan:

The Bram.

Mari:

Stoker one, Having known me. Okay, if you've seen bits and pieces, she's the one that was like in the white dress with the red hair. She's Mina's friend, Okay, so Mina is the love interest. It's the Wynonna Ryder character in the movie. It's the love interest that Dracula is like. It's the reincarnation of his love interest that Dracula is like.

Mari:

It's the reincarnation of his love. Lucy is Mina's friend and, yeah, lucy dies early on. She dies one of the first. I think she's probably the first character in the book and the movie to die and she is an interesting character because she's very young but she is basically being her whole personality is who she's gonna marry, so she's a lot of times portrayed as this very hyper sexualized character. Um. So it's interesting seeing this, this take on it. The cover caught me because it's got this like pale, red-haired, huge red-haired woman on the cover and then, the more you look at it, the hair is actually wolves.

Jonathan:

It's a really cool looking cover. It looks like. I was like how many pearls does she have in her hair? This is way too many. How do they not fall down? And I was like, hmm, those are teethers.

Mari:

Those are wolfies, puppers. Anyways, it looked interesting. And then the last thing, and this will be the last time I mention it, because this episode is going live while I'm at DragonCon, while DragonCon is happening. So I'm at DragonCon in Atlanta, sci-fi, fantasy Con. If you're there, contact us, maybe we can hang out, say hi, etc. Love to meet you. Anybody else have any?

Kelly:

news. Hey, let me throw something here in the news real quick for you, etc. Love to meet you. Anybody else have any news? Hey, let me throw something here in the news real quick for you, Mari, because this story just broke. Utah, the state of Utah, has outlawed a list of books statewide. That includes Sarah J Maas.

Mari:

Oh I sit down.

Kelly:

So, in addition to the usual suspects of judy bloom, margaret atwood, sarah j mass was added to the list, which represents the first time, I guess, a popular romanacy author has been added to the list well, isn't the list supposed to be for children's books?

Mari:

right, it is all school districts right, so I mean Sarah J Maas. They're not kids books, they're new adult, they're not even YA. Are all of her books, ah, you know what it might be, because I know she was very young. I want to say she was like 18 or something when she wrote it right TOG.

Ashley:

Throne of Glass.

Mari:

We're going to have to read these books, guys.

Jonathan:

We are going to have to read these books, guys. We are going to have to read these Before they've taken away. I just want to make sure that I fully understand, Kelly. Are you telling me that in the state of Utah you can have multiple wives, as long as you don't write about it?

Kelly:

Not in the entire state of Utah.

Mari:

And not in the modern version of the religion. There are cults where I think that happens, but there are cults in lots of religions where that happens.

Ashley:

If I bring the book to Utah, am I in trouble? No, it's just that it's basically just banned.

Kelly:

It's basically been banned from schools charter schools and the like.

Mari:

You know what's interesting? I thought this was the case Throne of Glass, written by Sarah J Maas. She first started writing that when she was 16 years old, 16. So she as a 16-year-old could write it, but current 16-year-olds can't read it. So to me, throne of Glass is really just fantasy. I wouldn't classify that as romanticist.

Ashley:

To me, it's a fantasy series, right well, I think, because she was so young, so her perspective was right. Yeah, yeah to me it's.

Mari:

It's as much a fantasy series as throne of glass. It's. It's fantasy like court of thorns and roses akatar, absolutely romanticist, absolutely. There's some spice scenes. There's some, yeah, but throne of glass I I mean I read the whole series in like a month, so my memory's not great, but I don't remember it being that spicy.

Ashley:

I mean, I'm not opposed, and I see their intention. I guess um sorry, I moved my head. I see their intention. Think the whole I don't want to get. I have feelings. Yeah, thanks, kelly. We like the good news.

Kelly:

Well, I find it more interesting that of the authors that were banned by Utah in this move, four of the five are women.

Mari:

Mm-hmm.

Kelly:

So no banning of controversial books that were written by men.

Ashley:

I mean not for nothing, margaret Atwood is.

Mari:

Yeah, anyone who asks me for a horror recommendation or what's the scariest book I've ever read, it's always the Handmaid's Tale. It will forever be the Handmaid's Tale. Remember what you were saying, Kelly.

Kelly:

We've talked about this before. You know, with the whole thing, that Margaret Atwood is the one of the most prolifically banned authors of the modern times, it seems, which is ironic considering what she writes about. Yep.

Mari:

Or what her most famous book is for.

Kelly:

Well, yeah, I mean you have to be get to the point where you you have to revel in it, I guess. But I think it's a perfect thing for us to keep in mind because, seeing as how this podcast will be released towards the beginning of September or almost at the beginning of September remember that September 22nd through the 28th is banned book week- Ooh.

Mari:

So read a banned book, share a banned book, buy your loved one a banned book, do it. We're basically done with the news, but I wanted to bring this up. So I know in past episodes we've talked about, like, how romancy is viewed as a genre, Like the other day, the other episode I mentioned, how it seems like romance has to constantly be defending itself as a valid literature, form of literature or genre or whatever, Whereas something like sci-fi maybe, when it first came out, had to be had to defend itself, but not as much now. And I was in this Reddit discussion and there is a Reddit poster on there who just summed it up very well, so I'm going to read what she had to say. She said idea of value.

Mari:

Romance, and, by extension, romantasy, has classically been primarily dominated by female writers and readers. In a society where things that are enjoyed by women are often culturally labeled as inferior or silly, internalized misogyny can make us assign value by a patriarchal standard. It gets boiled down to man-chest covers and fairy porn. Sometimes it's valuable to find an escape in something. Sometimes it's valuable to find comfort in a story where you know things turn out happily, especially if a reader has anxiety or other traumas. Romance and its sub-genres, is one of the most progressive. It centers women, older protagonists, BIPOC, disabled and neurodivergent characters much more frequently though not frequently enough than other genres. And, more simply, Romanesie is a huge umbrella for a wide variety of books. There are books for nearly every taste. Like Crushed it. Yes, all the applause.

Mari:

This was JD Evans. Jd Evans Books is the Reddit handle and JD Evans is actually an author herself. I messaged her to ask her if I could read this on the podcast and she actually writes romance ebooks. I was like interesting. So she writes the Mages of the Wheel series. The first one is called Rain and Ruin. They're actually on my TBR but there's like a billion things on my TBR so I didn't recognize the name. Just buy it. But maybe it might be something we might read on down the road for the podcast because it actually looks pretty interesting. Six Scorched Roses is a standalone novella in the Crowns of Niaxia world created by Carissa Broadbent.

Jonathan:

What's a novella? So like I know that we say that word bunch.

Mari:

Basically a novella is another word for a short short book, Like there's an actual definition of it, Like there's novella and then there's novelette. The novelette isn't used as much. A novella is a narrative prose fiction whose length is shorter than most novels but longer than most novelettes and short stories.

Ashley:

So it's between a short story and a novel that's what I was going to say like bigger than a story, yeah, but shorter than a book.

Mari:

Book yeah, several things I'm finding says that it's around 100 pages. Of course, this book was like 200 pages, but it's around 100 pages. It's, yeah, it's, it's longer than a short story, but it's not quite a fully fledged novel so I think 200 is respectable as a novella I think, anything less than 200.

Ashley:

You're not getting a lot across.

Kelly:

I think the standard is that a short story is a thousand words, you know, but less than 10 000 for sure. Well, a, a novelette, is 7,500 to 19,000 words, a novella is 10,000 to 40,000 words, and a novel is anything more than that.

Mari:

Okay.

Kelly:

So generally a novella is like yeah, 100 pages.

Mari:

So this one was published in March, March 20th, 2023. I thought I'd read somewhere that it was published as an indie publishing, for because I know Chris abroad been you know did a lot of her stuff as indie published before she got picked up, but I couldn't. I couldn't find and confirm that. So publication date we're going to go by is March 20th of 2023. I'm going to read the synopsis and then we can get into it a little bit more.

Mari:

Six roses, six files of blood, six visits to a vampire who could be her salvation or her damnation. Lilith has been dying since the day she was born, but while she, long ago, came to terms with her own imminent death, the deaths of everyone she loves is an entirely different matter. As her town slowly withers in the clutches of a mysterious, God-cursed illness, she takes matters into her own hands, Desperate to find a cure. Lilith strikes a bargain with the only thing the gods hate even more than her village a vampire Vale. She offers him six roses in exchange for six vials of vampire blood, the one hope for her town's salvation. But when what begins as a simple transaction gradually becomes something more, Lilith is faced with a terrifying realization. It's dangerous to wander into the clutches of a vampire and, in a place already suffering a god's wrath, more dangerous still, to fall in love with one Bum bum. What did you guys think? Non-spoilery what did we think?

Ashley:

I think it's a short story. It was okay. I wasn't riveted. I thought it was interesting to have a female main character that presented. Probably and I don't know if this is intentional or not maybe, but I definitely got autistic vibes from her, yeah same.

Ashley:

And I thought that was an interesting perspective. We've seen maybe different versions of autism or ADHD in male characters, but like you, you would read about her masking right and like her self awareness that she couldn't read people and how she had to train or memorize what emotions are supposed to look like on someone else and I thought that was really great, really great representation. I like Carissa Broadbent as an author. I read the crowns of Niaxia books and was a big fan, but I think this tangent, like this standalone. It was nice, I enjoyed reading. It Wasn't, you know, earth shattering for me, but I really liked the perspective of the female main character and her drive right. Like that drive is probably leaning towards you know those two stars, three stars.

Kelly:

Okay, kelly, I know you go ahead who me?

Mari:

you want me to do it next yes okay.

Mari:

So I really liked, I really like this novella. I liked you know that Lilith was neuro spicy. I like that she was all sciencey. I like that she was a woman of action. You know, she's like I've got this limited time on this earth. I got to make the most of it and I'm going to do what I can to like leave it a better place than than when I got here. I, to me, this was a well done, very well done. Beauty and the Beast retelling like oh yeah, yeah, this is Beauty and the Beast retelling. This is absolutely 100% Beauty and the Beast and I love the story Beauty and the Beast. I also love vampire stories and vampire books. So this was just. This was custom made for me on so many levels. So for me it was a five.

Ashley:

Wow yeah, High praise. I think if it was longer I would have rated higher.

Kelly:

Yeah.

Ashley:

Not that anything was wrong with the novella itself inappropriate. I got closure from it, but if it were longer I probably would have.

Mari:

Yeah, I think you'll enjoy the. Oh my God, what's the name of the other one, the Emperor Slaying the Vampire Conqueror? It's her other standalone in the. Oh, I haven't read it. She has another standalone in the Crowns of Niaxia series. It's called Slaying the Vampire Conqueror and it is longer. It's not a novella, it's a full-blown book. Would recommend Her world building.

Ashley:

So good. Maybe that's also the problem, too right Like I know how good it can be.

Mari:

Yeah, yeah, and I, you know, I wonder, and I'd never had this experience, because you know, I've already, like you, I've already read the other Crowns of Niaxia book. But I wonder if I was reading it as a true standalone, like if I didn't know anything about the rest of the Crowns of Naxia books, if I would feel differently. But I don't have that perspective. So I just, yeah, I very much liked it. It's a 5 for me. Who's next? Who likes the boys?

Ashley:

Which boy, kelly, who do you want to go first?

Kelly:

Go ahead, Jonathan.

Jonathan:

I thought it was a good book. I enjoyed it. I didn't get the masking vibe out of it but I definitely picked up on the autism stuff it was. To me it was autism meets the empire, crashes and glides, with some parallels to the modern politics I thought it was it left me wanting more. I don't think it was. I'm not going quite as high as Mari, but I'll give it a four, Four stars.

Mari:

High praise. I want to add one more thing to mine that I always keep forgetting that the main character is actually not like 18 year old or 20, or whatever. She's all of 30 years old, ancient, yes, veritable spinster.

Jonathan:

Interesting. I would say I did not pick up on the B5 oh, I did.

Ashley:

It was in my brain to talk about later.

Jonathan:

I mean there was, I didn't do you see it now? I didn't get the conversion. At the end of the day, I thought character pathways were static also plot twist oh no spoiler that's for later.

Mari:

Hold it for the rest.

Jonathan:

Where have you been at with this book, Kelly?

Kelly:

I would say it's a three. I thought it was okay. It had some good parts, but it's just. I didn't really care for some of the elements in it. I know it was a Beauty and the Beast retelling so I know there was going to be Stockholm Syndrome elements to it. I did enjoy the main female character, the way she was portrayed. I did enjoy the fact that she wasn't an 18-year-old, so it was nice to see something different than what we've been reading. But it was fairly predictable, did we read the same book.

Jonathan:

I did not get Stockholm Syndrome. I didn't get Beauty and the Beast. I didn't get Stockholm Syndrome. This lady wasn't a prisoner. I didn't get masking. I didn't get beauty and the beast. I didn't get Stockholm syndrome. This lady wasn't a prisoner, didn't get masking, didn't get masking.

Ashley:

She literally said, of the emotions that I have memorized on other people's faces.

Mari:

Yeah, yeah, but that's not masking. That is classic masking, that's not masking.

Ashley:

Yeah, because she can't read emotions.

Jonathan:

No, no, I'm a master of masking, so she has to try to mimic them too. No, that's not bad, Okay.

Mari:

So what's it called when people who have trouble reading emotions? What's the term for that?

Jonathan:

Autistic.

Mari:

Okay, yeah, the exact quote was I searched his face for one of the many signs I'd memorized that someone was making fun of me, telling me something that wasn't true. So she had to memorize facial cues because she doesn't really get them, which is a neurodivergent thing.

Ashley:

Kelly, what was your rating? You said three.

Jonathan:

Three. That's the sound of irritation in Ashley's voice, just you know.

Mari:

Have you taught yourself that? Oh, yeah, yeah, I think I want to. All right, kelly, do the little spoiler spiel and we can get into more details.

Kelly:

Sure, from this point forward, dear listeners, we will be discussing spoilers, so if you do not want to be spoiled, then you should stop the podcast here and come back after you've read it.

Jonathan:

Who doesn't want to be spoiled? I want to be spoiled.

Mari:

Spend the extra money on me.

Jonathan:

That's what I'm saying.

Mari:

Take me shopping quote about how she's neuro, neuro, spicy, it says, in a family of warmth. I was the strange, cold one, the one who could decipher textbooks and equations, but struggled to decipher the exact cadence of a voice that made a name a term of endearment, nor the pattern of a touch that made it a caress like poetry yeah, yeah.

Mari:

So I feel that it was like Beauty and the Beast in that, you know, she, she went to him. There was the, the, the symbology of the roses involved. He was, you know, potentially the beast or whatever. He could kill her. He was going to be attacked and her, her instinct was to go and save the beast. When the mob was after him, he saves her and then, you know, I guess she wasn't like it's not like the things in the house became people or whatever, like meeting the beast, but he opened up her world. He took her to this world of the vampires and she's going to get to travel and you, you know it'd be a different life than she ever thought she would have. So, I don't know, there's, I think there's it's not a.

Jonathan:

It's not a, you know there are hints, lists of of of like parallels. I just uh when I think and maybe I'm just thinking of the big story elements in in beauty and the Beast, where there's a character development that dramatically changes the character transforms.

Mari:

I didn't get the transformative From Vale, from the guy. Well, she changed his entire perspective.

Ashley:

And then, plot twist, she becomes the monster at the end, I think he interesting, interesting take on it.

Jonathan:

I don't know if that's the truth it is.

Ashley:

She becomes a vampire. Yeah, she becomes the very thing that he is.

Jonathan:

I I yeah, but I don't think that he views himself as a monster. I think he left. I think he left the world of. He felt he felt maybe his peers were doing things in a way that he didn't want to, and I think that she went into the situation to look for a solution and didn't view him Like that's the autistic trait. Right, we're going to look at things a little bit differently. We might pick up a tool differently because we see an alternative purpose and not necessarily think about all the risks that are associated. I think if we were going to lean into a transformative story element, it's when she cornered him about the classism, the two types of vampires natural born and, at the end of the day, the type that he valued most of all was uh, the term no was the born oh, you're at the end of the story.

Mari:

I'm sorry. Yeah, yeah, I see what you mean. Yeah, yeah, yeah, he was transformed that way, and I would also argue that he was transformed by her, in that he was basically running away from his world, his responsibilities, his life, and he was just asleep. Almost a sleeping beauty thing, I guess, rather than than than beauty and the beast, he was asleep something to be said for licking your wounds after a war that you lost right, but I think she woke him up back to the world coming, yeah, and and he didn't.

Ashley:

He didn't agree with the supposed leader choice, right, without knowing, like, he didn't have all the context, he didn't have all the details you and I know what those are and so, yeah, he didn't want any part of it. So, when she brought in her perspective, you know about, about doing the most for the people that you do have, like look what she was trying to accomplish right for people for most of the town that you do have. Like look what she was trying to accomplish right for people for most of a town that despised her. For, yeah, no good reason. Yeah, I, I, I saw the transfer on both sides I agree.

Mari:

Anything else general stuff we want to talk about before we get into the the fantasy rating. What was the order? I think the order we went was you first ash. What do you think about the fantasy?

Ashley:

Again, I think because the book was so short, we didn't get to see as much as we did in the larger novels. I mean really the most I mean we saw. I guess we see a god, right, and then vampires. This book was just very average for me. I wanted more and I didn't get it because it was a novella. And again, I just get it because it was a novella, and again I just know how much it was. I didn't see a lot of magic. I didn't see a lot of. I saw science. That's realistic, right, yeah I mean science is magical.

Ashley:

It's magical, but it's not magic heavy science although there was a quote somewhere that I read, and it said something like everything is magic until you discover how it's actually made. Yeah, something like that. And in their world, it blends.

Mari:

They use magic to do science.

Ashley:

Yeah, it was a three. I wanted more. I was happy with what I got. I wasn't unsatisfied.

Mari:

For me it was a five. Once again, I have a hard time distinguishing. I know Distinguishing.

Ashley:

Like were your toes curling if you're giggling the whole time? I loved it. I really did.

Mari:

I really did Like vampires and then like a pantheon of gods. That dichotomy I just. I've read a lot of vampire books like when I say a lot, I mean like if a vampire book existed from when I was in high school, through all of college I devoured it, like all you had to do was tell me you had vampire something and I was reading it. So I've read a lot of vampire books and I don't remember reading a vampire book or vampire series or story that kind of created this pantheon of gods and gave a reason.

Ashley:

Yeah, that's a unique perspective.

Mari:

Yeah, as to why these vampires exist in this world. I also like the idea of different clans or houses of vampires. That's not new but it's an idea I've liked ever since. I like for me. I think the first place I saw that was in the Kindred TV show, which was so good, based off of from the role playing game. But I like, I like the different houses, I like the pantheon of the gods, I like that mix of magic and science. Um, yeah, I, I. To me, the fantasy was was very, very there for me, so it was a five surprise JP.

Jonathan:

I thought there was. I thought it was a good mix of fantasy. It felt like there was just not fantasy. There was the, the idea that she had enchanted tool to view some of the magical, the vampire blood that her cells out of cellular. I felt that the idea that this slow kind of rotting death was taking place around her was just disintegrating, Just kind of like you're falling dust to dust and ash to ash. You're just kind of drying out and withering away.

Jonathan:

Very Marvel An accelerated pace yet slowed down all at the same time.

Ashley:

And like evidence of it.

Jonathan:

Mm-hmm, yeah, the idea that you would sweep yourself up afterwards, the deity, the different families of gods are restricted, and the idea that you just kind of pray, that you can just pray your troubles away. We're just going to send you a positive thoughts and keep you in our thoughts and hopefully fix things. The just blindly trying to resolve situations, all the way down to the idea of roses and how she kept challenging me to it. Was it because? Did you pick up on it? I know I picked up on it when they said when she would give him a rose and trade trade the rose for the vial, but then, like a month later she came back give him a rose. It's like I don't, you know, I don't see anything special, but he would get down next to the one she gave him last month. One of you ever had a rose that was a month old, didn't look like that and was still hanging around, right.

Mari:

So like the idea that that it's almost like they all were so removed from the world that he was asleep, you know yeah time passed differently for him until she woke him up matter to him, hey, so those kinds of things.

Jonathan:

I thought it was a really solid mix of of the fantasy elements there. I hesitate to give it a five. I would give it a four. I think what would make to give it a five. I would give it a four. I think what would make me give it a five. A critter of some kind, a sidekick, a sidekick, yeah, like a. Yeah, a sidekick I definitely got positive supporting cast vibes, but I feel like there should have been a cat or a goat.

Ashley:

You've already had a goat, I know.

Jonathan:

It's hard to top Lou and you're not going to top a spider plant, kaz, kaz, yeah. So it's just kind of like and zombie cat is probably not. It's hard to beat. So maybe you've got to get like George the One-Eyed Squirrel or something like that. But I would definitely. I'm in that four range. It would take a critter to push me to five high praise for you tonight.

Kelly:

I gave it a two and a half. I was maybe if I read some of the other books, since this is a short story, slash novella set in a pre-established world with its own mythology and world building, that maybe you're expected to know some of this because you've read some of the other books. So, having not read any of them, maybe it hamstrung me a little bit. But I felt like there was a lot of things that were just thrown out there and I understand, in a novella you can't spend a lot of time explaining things but at the same time there was a lot of fantasy elements that were very predictable. You know immediately. You see the character's name, lilith. That name has been used so much for female sorcerers or female vampires because of its associations going back into, you know, all the way back into early Christianity, early Greece, you know, and Jewish mysticism and stuff that Lilith being associated with being a vampire or a succubus. So like, oh, her name's Lilith. Well, she's definitely going to end up becoming a vampire.

Ashley:

Isn't Lilith the supposedly like the first wife?

Kelly:

Yeah, it depends on which mythology and which part you consider. There's some that certain scholars think that it traces back to where Lilith was supposed to be the first wife of Adam and she was his equal. Then she was cast out because she demanded to be treated equally and then she ended up becoming the mother of demons. There's a lot of associated stuff with the name Lilith and a lot of it comes down to demons and vampires and succubus and stuff like that. So when you see that name, when you name a character, that you're telling your readers what you're going to do. So I didn't really care for that too much.

Kelly:

I found it interesting the way the religion worked with the different gods. I think it was interesting. It hinted at something interesting with the whole different factions of gods fighting and having a falling out. So that was kind of interesting. I liked that there was a science element, but I disliked how they were doing. Science was really not science. Science was magic, you know, because you had to study things by using magical instruments. She was studying blood with a magical instrument, so it was really magic. It wasn't science.

Mari:

Yeah, because they didn't have electricity really, so like.

Kelly:

Right, she didn't have a microscope. She had a magic glass that you know had runes on it that let her see. So, yeah, she was using principles of like the scientific method, I guess, but it really wasn't science as much as it was magic. And, like I said, maybe if I had read some of the other books, because this is kind of like a novella that takes place in this pre-established world and it was written after you know other books in this world. So I think my expectation is that the people who read this for the most part are people who've already read other books in this series. Right, so they already know all of the backstory, they already know all of the world building. So, having not read any of that, I think that probably affected my rating.

Mari:

So what'd you think of the romance Ash?

Ashley:

Romance romance. Actually I. It was a slow burn for me but I liked what was there, like I let I think, because it was a novella, that the the slow burn worked in its favor, kind of thing. I thought the romance was a four. It was satisfactory.

Mari:

What do you think, Mara? I know this is a shock. You're not going to guess. Romance is a five for me, oh.

Jonathan:

I did not see that coming. I didn't see it coming. No.

Mari:

Like the way that she was like Prince Charming, waking him up and he was Sleeping Beauty. She brought him to life, she brought him into the world. She brought him back into the modern or the present time and how she defended him when the town was attacking him and burning him, and then, at the end, when he literally goes to fight a god for her. Yes, all romance, no notes.

Jonathan:

yeah, five hearts jp you know what I I felt there was strong romance here. The yeah, I there was definitely. I felt you felt felt period period, um, yeah, I thought there was strong romance here throughout the entire, almost throughout the entire story. So I'm gonna I'm gonna give it five what is going on? Well, how did? How did it rate on the, on the wait it, how did it rate for you on the kilometer?

Kelly:

I thought it was a three there was. I don't know. I'm not as big a fan of the Beauty and the Beast style retellings as Mari is. I feel like I don't know. I just wasn't a fan of the way this romance played out.

Ashley:

One day, kelly, one day, we're going to find it for you. I have faith.

Mari:

So question Of the classic fairy tale stories what's everyone's favorite?

Jonathan:

All of them, I don't know how to have one, the Matrix.

Ashley:

Like the Cinderella story.

Mari:

Yeah, like the archetypes of the story. So there's Beauty and the Beast, there's Sleeping Beauty, there's Cinderella, there's Little Mermaid. Like what? Of those tropes or archetypes of fairy tales, which one?

Jonathan:

do you like Three Looking Glass?

Ashley:

The Adventure. That's what it is, the Alice in Wonderland.

Jonathan:

The drug usage.

Mari:

Yeah, the portal fantasy. It's called the portal fantasy. Yeah, okay, kelly.

Kelly:

I think fairy tales are nice for children, but when you start analyzing them as an adult you realize that almost all of them have significant problems, especially the Disney 5 versions, Not to say that the Hans Christian Andersen ones aren't very dark and disturbing if you actually read the original ones.

Ashley:

And that's why I don't.

Jonathan:

It's what led you to marry me.

Ashley:

That's a fair analysis.

Kelly:

Well, I mean, the Disney Sleeping Beauty is vastly different than the original Sleeping Beauty.

Mari:

Yeah, do you know what brought her to life in the original Grimm's fairy tale, the old fairy tale? Do you know what woke up Sleeping Beauty? It wasn't a kiss. Do you guys know what it was?

Jonathan:

Did they? Was it the banging?

Mari:

It was her giving birth after he had raped her in her sleep.

Jonathan:

Dang. That's one way to.

Ashley:

We will not be, reading any of those for this podcast. We like happy ending.

Jonathan:

Speaking of climax All the fairy tales are super dark.

Mari:

Spice Jonathan's trying.

Ashley:

That was good, that was good. Actually, that wasn't the worst segue. Right Spice for me was it was a three. I thought it was very polite. Spice Again, it was a novella, so it was shorter, so we didn't get a lot happening, but what did was pleasant, it was polite, it was. Yeah, it was a three for me, mari Actually it was a three.

Mari:

Yeah, it was a three. For me too. This wasn't like a super spice heavy book. It was about as expected, because it is. It's a short book and there's a lot of plot in it and a lot of romance buildup, and I I think it's that's part of why I like it so much is it does pack a lot of story into such a short book. Um, and I think that if there were more spice in it, it would it would have to be a longer book. It just wouldn't blow the story any other way it would have been forced Right Right, and we prefer confetti.

Mari:

Yes.

Ashley:

A hundred percent.

Jonathan:

Um you know spice, right it's is interesting. Went into this thinking that it was going to be a little more spicy than it was. Early on he was backdooring another vampire. The banging didn't exist. For me it didn't happen for me. So I'm going to have to pull back. I'm going to go with a three for spice. It just didn't hit Charlie what did you end up with?

Kelly:

No, I gave it a two and a half. I thought it was as expected. It was average. There was nothing terribly spicy or lack thereof. It was just kind of middle of the road. Okay, what spicy? Or?

Mari:

lack thereof. It was just kind of middle of the road. What do we think of the cover? The cover was I'm going to let you go first because that's the order we have it in but I will just say that the cover was done by Story Wrappers and Thor Publishing. What do you think, ash?

Ashley:

I like it. I mean, I don't think there's six on the cover, but I really like the symbolism on the cover. I like the print, I like the. I think it's actually a really nice cover. I'm a fan. This is a four and a half for me. It's just pretty. I would have picked it up in a store.

Mari:

So for me, I think I appreciate the cover a little bit after I read the book, but for the most part I wasn't a big fan. I don't know that I would have picked it up in the store because it doesn't really tell me anything of what it's about. It's maybe a little too abstract for me. And yeah, it was like two and a half.

Jonathan:

I was confused by the cover. It was busy. It was too busy for my eyes. It was too busy for my eyes. I liked the script on the front, or the font that they used for the front of the cover. I don't know that I would have picked it up, but it didn't hit it. I gave it a three. It's not the worst, but it's definitely the best that I've seen. Kelly, where'd you land on it?

Kelly:

I also gave it a two and a half. I thought it was okay, like it was visually appealing a little bit. But yeah, I agree with Mari, I don't think the cover alone would have had me picking up the book, nor did I think it really represented anything about what was going on in the book other than the fact that roses were involved.

Mari:

Yeah, all right. And do we think it is a kissing book? Is this a kissing book? Yes, I agree, not rapid fire, sorry, yeah, all right. And do we?

Ashley:

think it is a kissing book. Is this a?

Mari:

kissing book. Yes, I agree, it's not rapid fire. Sorry, yeah, no, but I agree yes.

Jonathan:

Man. I dropped this one through the Romantilator and came up with no.

Ashley:

There's no banging. Almost everything's going to be a no for you.

Kelly:

Yeah, no, it's going to be hard.

Ashley:

You're going to be sorely disappointed with the next book.

Mari:

So apparently we're going to be sorely disappointed with the next book. Yeah, so apparently we're going to need to read some Ruby Dixon or some Katie Roberts or some Rebecca Kennedy or Tiffany Roberts for Jonathan. We need some like high spice content, high spice At some point in the coming year.

Jonathan:

Okay, but this one, this one dropped through, came out with a hell, nah.

Ashley:

It does say hell, nah, sorry. What do you think, kelly, kelly, what say you?

Kelly:

I decided that it was romancy because the plot was hinging upon the romantic elements between the two characters. So without the romance the plot would have fallen apart. Because of that, I felt like it had to be a Romanesie for sure. I also really strongly identified when she said that time is the most valuable resource of all and some of us are perpetually short.

Mari:

I highlighted both of those things too. And what did he give her? He gave her time, yep.

Kelly:

All the time. Yes, he saw her. He got her yes Tale as old as time with Vale and Lilith especially Lilith than I ever thought they would. And learning that you know it's because these two characters appear in the other books of the series that you know that further later on or I guess before this or whatever these two characters are like secondary characters in the other books in the Crowns of Naxia. So she's basically saying how the readers really had a strong affinity for Lilith and maybe that was part of what drove the author to write kind of this novella about their backstory.

Kelly:

But she commented specifically on how she found so many of her readers saw themselves in Lilith and Lilith struggled to connect meaningfully with other people. I think the author has touched into kind of a strong feeling in today's society that so many people feel like we're not making meaningful connections with people anymore. You know the whole. You can't make friends when you're an adult type mentality, right, like it's so hard to get meaningful connections where it's like the I can't remember who said it, but someone. I remember someone saying it. I think it was like in a Ted talk maybe or something they were saying we live in a world where we're all more connected than ever, yet we're all so disconnected and struggling to connect with each other.

Mari:

Yeah, and I would have loved to have found out when she started writing this book. We know it was published in 2023. I mean, we know it takes a long time to get a book published. You know it takes a long time to, like, edit a book, and all that after you publish it. And so I mean, that's not that long after. Covid and the pandemic and when everyone was feeling the PTSD of disconnection right, and that's.

Kelly:

That was the same thing I thought was. Is this a product of the the author and the readers sentiments, the product of the pandemic? Yeah you know, or is it just part of the broader sense that we feel like we can't relate to other people anymore? We've never been more different, that you know. The internet and social media and everything else has done an enormous amount to highlight our differences and make it more difficult to connect to other people. We see more of our differences than we see more of our similarities nowadays.

Mari:

All right. So onto our rapid fire segment, keeping with the vampire theme that we have going on. We are put it out to on the socials, to people to see what vampire related story they thought we should do a rapid fire segment on. And I'm stalling because I'm trying to look and see who actually suggested this. I'm so sorry. I'll tell you in a sec, but we're going to be doing Twilight. Twilight the movie, whether or not it is a kissing book.

Jonathan:

Not the time of day.

Mari:

Not the time of day. So Twilight is it a kissing book? Twilight, the movie is it a kissing book? Me first, if you want to.

Ashley:

Yeah, we can keep the same order. Keep the same order, keep the same order. Yeah, I mean much to. Probably many, many persons dismay it. It is very much a kissing book. It's very much a kissing movie. Yeah, and the the thought process in that, with jonathan's calculator aside, is that if these two weren't connected and didn't not force the connection but explore that connection, this story doesn't exist. Yeah, and there's a lot to the story, there's a lot in each book, but it doesn't exist. If she had chosen Jacob, if she died?

Mari:

If he had eaten her.

Ashley:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. If any of them had eaten her, yeah, yeah, yeah. If any of them had eaten her, yeah Right, their story would go on, but it wouldn't be this story and it very much wouldn't have gotten anywhere near the ending that we did, yep. So, yes, it's a kissing book for me, mari All right.

Mari:

So for me, basically, yeah, same answer. I believe it's a kissing book because I think that if it wasn't for the romance attraction, edward would have just eaten bella and that would have been it, or they would have moved or something I was gonna say, or they just would have left. Yeah, they just would have left. Also, like the whole idea of the family and them being like vegetarian vampers or whatever. It's all like this about this love for humanity and love of family. There's a lot of like romance elements in it. Yeah, so I'd say yes, kissing book this is a tough one for me.

Jonathan:

Here I had such a the glare he gave me when I was giving my response so I I did put it through the romantilator and it came back with a hell, nah, an even worse score than before. But I'm going to make an exception and I'm going to say that it's a kissing book, but not for the reasons that Ashley does. Not for my reasons, not for your reasons, not at all. Ashley kissed me after that movie.

Ashley:

That's a valid reason. Listeners, I'm not sure if you know Kelly.

Kelly:

I have no idea, because I've never seen Twilight the movie, nor have I ever read the book.

Ashley:

Blasphemy.

Jonathan:

No, Kelly's cool.

Mari:

Kelly bought me the book but hasn't read the book or seen the movie. He's the one who got me turned on to it. He started it.

Ashley:

You're to blame. Kelly, you have to read the terrible story.

Kelly:

Why would I want to read that?

Mari:

So you're going to abstain?

Kelly:

Look, the only good thing I could possibly say about Twilight is for all of whatever its flaws may be, at least it got a bunch of teenagers reading.

Mari:

Right, it did. It got people reading, got people excited about books, buying books and getting together and talking about them. Yeah, I mean no harm, no foul. It's not great literature, it's not the best thing ever written, but it was a fun book.

Jonathan:

I remember at the time enjoying it.

Mari:

You know enjoying when the new books came out and what was going to happen next, you know, and enjoying the movies.

Ashley:

It was a fun time, and kudos to the movies for doing the Alice scene in the last one, because if that didn't blow your mind, you're not human. That was so exquisitely done in a way that the books didn't even describe, right yeah, phenomenal, well done, high praise. So, kelly, this is a kissing book. You can borrow ours, yeah, yeah is that where we're at kelly?

Jonathan:

yeah, he's got reddit or you're imposing.

Ashley:

I'm imposing people now yeah we are unanimously aligned there was no banging I mean, there was banging and then her powers came after.

Mari:

No, no, there's nothing in our original definition of romanticism. That said that there had to be a bangeting.

Jonathan:

Oh yeah, there's no rules. Rules are their honor rules.

Mari:

Maybe at the beginning of the year we'll have to revamp a few things and decide if we want to judge things differently come the beginning of the year. But we can look into that.

Jonathan:

I'll let you impact my romance later. I mean not for nothing, dear husband. Ventilator.

Ashley:

You can make it. I mean not for nothing, dear husband, but even in your own scoring today, you scored the romance super high and the spice is only average. We are talking about romanticy, Romance.

Mari:

Yeah, this isn't like an erotica rating, alright. On that note, thanks for listening to Of Swords and Soulmates. Before we go, make sure to check the show notes, rate, review, review and subscribe to us on your podcast app of choice and follow us on Instagram at of swords and soulmates, or join our Facebook page of swords and soulmates, or check out our website of swords and soulmatescom, and now we're also available on YouTube and Tik TOK, same username. If you'd like to offer a suggestion for a future rapid fire question, a future read, just your comment or your opinion on something, reach out to us at any of the options listed above or you can email us. If you'd like to read along with us as we prep for a new episode, follow us on Goodreads at of swords and soulmates. We hope you'll join us in two weeks for our next episode when we review Assistant to the Villain by Hannah Nicole Mayer. Bye, bye, you.

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Mari

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Ashley

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Jonathan

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Kelly

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